Unnecessary instructions given
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    Test this region in West Germany: http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/51.9968/8.6172

    Coming from east, before the first slip road to A2, drive the B 66 west, then right (north) to L787 Nordring. You will get twice "turn left", and shortly before Ostring "keep straight". I could not find any reason in the OSM data. Do you?

    Additionally, I cannot remember having seen the lane assistant, although lane data are given. What is the reason for this?
  • 45 Comments sorted by
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    in English I have only one command
    not sure about lanes, but this link was edited 13 days ago

  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    The issue is much (?) older, I just forgot to report it. Both German tts and Doris are affected.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    I tried Doris - I do not speak German, but after announcement of 500 yards I get something like 'eine meine...', if I set metric system, I do not get this announcement after 500m

    interestingly, I can see lane assistant
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    This is no language issue, it seems. When I select starting and ending points and calculate the route, the written result contains two turns left. Maybe your points are wrong? I could share mine later.

    In simulation mode, I still don't see the lane assistant.
    Please also note that turning right to Ostring for the app is to drive straight....
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    I set departure at 51.99026/8.63012 and destination at 52.00423/8.62374
    map data 44
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    In my xml file: from 187176025/31048797 to 187203180/30990778
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    I could see lane assistant twice, first before the motorway and second before turning to Ostring.
    I had one Go straight at 51.99571/8.6176 - is this the one you dislike?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    Maybe the lane assistant does not appear for the same reason like my missing object information at the bottom....

    The going straight comes exactly before Ostring, instead of turning right (that we are actually doing instead).

    What about the two turns left - don't they appear for you?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    I have only one left turning
    do you have detailed navigation selected?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    I did edit it (http://forum.mapfactor.com/discussion/comment/7077#Comment_7077) BUT again: the problem is older than my first attempts to edit this file. Some weeks ago, I drove the same route, getting the same wrong instructions.

    But at least you have one left turn: can you see why?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    I have no idea why do you get two
    do you have detailed navigation selected?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    chattiewoman said: "Test this region in West Germany: http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/51.9968/8.6172

    Coming
    from east, before the first slip road to A2, drive the B 66 west, then
    right (north) to L787 Nordring. You will get twice "turn left", and
    shortly before Ostring "keep straight". I could not find any reason in
    the OSM data. Do you?"

    I get the exact same behaviour. Very weird. Tested in 1.3.24

    For some reason it behaves like the first exit is the same road and therefor you have to keep left to stay on the road (twice). Then taking the exit to the right it seems like it sees the exit as the same road. If we would go ahead here we would again hear a turn left.

    It think it has to do with the tag turn:lanes="through|through|slight_right" just before the exits (see also http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:turn).
    The mapper who did this was very, very conscious in what he/she was doing but it seems to lead to unexpected behavior.
    But "someone" has to check in the mapfactor map creation software how this is handled. I tried two other apps who don't do this. I have never seen this.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    but I get only the following manuevres:
    1. bear left on to Lagesche Strasse - 51.99443/8.62198
    2. ahead on to Lagesche Strasse - 51.99571/8.6176
    3. right on to Ostring Strasse - 51.99792/8.6074
    4. destination
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    Mine are:
    1. Turn left to Lagesche Straße - 51.99341/8.62448
    2. Turn left to Lagesche Straße - 51.9955/8.61853
    3. Ahead on Lagesche Straße (!!) - 51.99767/8.60902
    4. destination

    Are you using some kind of early map, or an app version later than 1.3.24?

  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    1.3.24, data version 44 (august)
    I have everything in default (car), so I think it must be something with your changes

    P.S. with v11.3.24 you can reset to default and make backup
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    I now did the reset (which all checkboxes ticked), and my result did not change.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    unbelievable :-)
    do you have latest maps?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    yes, from August ;-)
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    it should give the same result then, I have no idea why you get something else
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    I download my maps only by PC. Can that make any difference?

    As also hvdwolf could reproduce it, there must be more to it than my mere imagination ;-)
    Let's see what mdx will suggest.

    Edit: btw, another German user has exactly the same problem (Comment found on Google Play)
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    try to switch to English?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    chattiewoman said: "Mine are:
    1. Turn left to Lagesche Straße - 51.99341/8.62448
    2. Turn left to Lagesche Straße - 51.9955/8.61853
    3. Ahead on Lagesche Straße (!!) - 51.99767/8.60902
    4. destination"

    Mine are exactly the same: in Dutch, both tts as well as recorded voice. I have the 20140820 map of West Germany.

    @Tomas: Can you remove the tts.xml from the Navigator data folder? It should work without it as well. Next to that: unzip the new navigator.apk and copy the tts.xml from /raw/res to your navigator folder? I have been using the tts.xml to modifiy it and simply unzipped it from the apk. Maybe your tts.xml is differently

    (BTW: In night mode the new regions display for Germany doesn't show the light grey "active" maps for Germany. It's the same color)

  • Vote Up0Vote Down mdxmdx
    I can confirm the same behavior in PC navigator - there it is not twice left, but once bear left, once straight in the crossing of highway=motorway with highway=trunk. I believe that the reason for this unnecessary maneuvers is that it would be reported if it is junction with more important road ("motorway_link" is more important than "trunk"). I checked
    http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Dtrunk_link
    in particular: So when a link connects two highways of different classification, which
    do you use? Most maps show slip roads/ramps in the same colour as the
    through route they enter or leave.     Lower in the text is explained motorway_link so from OSM point of view it is correct.

    The same junction TomTom maps "inverse" i.e. all ramps/exists are of the lower importance class (in OSM trunk).

    p.s. I do not test voice - I only verify route itinerary & I do not use detailed navigation
    p.s.2 it is also a reason why such a junction looks ugly - more important roads are drawn later, i.e. first trunk then motorway(_link)
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    So what does it mean? I understood the OSM data are correct, thus the software needs an update.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    I think that mdx has the same manuevres as me
    1. bear left on to Lagesche Strasse - 51.99443/8.62198
    2. ahead on to Lagesche Strasse - 51.99571/8.6176
    3. right on to Ostring Strasse - 51.99792/8.6074
    4. destination

    question is why do German users have different set
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    I'm not a German user. I'm a Dutch user using Dutch language.

    (Based on the avatar I can imagine that you think chattiewoman and I are both german, but that's then the same for you and mdx :) )
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    German and Dutch users :-)
  • Vote Up0Vote Down mdxmdx
    well - I do not know, but from mine point of view the Tomas and Chattiewoman coordinates are "almost identical" ... I supposed that you are discussing two unnecessary maneuvers (in both cases 1 and 2) and not exact location (of arrow, junction, messages ... no idea)
    m.
    p.s. now I see it ... not right but Ahead instead ...so you are talking about point 3 ... in PCnav itinerary this is "take exit"
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    You should first figure out why you get different results than the users.... The manoeuvres should have been identical. Talking about Android only.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    I simply copied chattiewomans coordinates into the routing_points.xml and used that for routing. So I used the exact same coordinates.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    hvdwolf, did you see the lane assistant?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    Yes, I do have the lane assistant and that nicely shows what is happening:

    screenshot 1: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/34701986/NavigatorFree/screenshot-001.png

    screenshot 2: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/34701986/NavigatorFree/screenshot-002.png

    screenshot 3: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/34701986/NavigatorFree/screenshot-003.png

    I put it in portrait mode as that makes it in this case clearer
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    Well, at least on your screen shots I cannot see any lane assistant?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down mdxmdx
    Scary - on Android (with slightly older maps) I am getting now non-sense itinerary like Chattiewoman, but on PCnav I am getting itinerary like Tomas ... downloading germany_osm_west to verify current data. On PCnav I have seen lane assistant.

    Now I have new map, and I see Bear left, Ahead and Exit ... so something is not properly initialized or we now have slightly different maps. (I see lane assistant)

    Edit: p.s. - now I checked PCnav with OLD data 2014.6 (in particular germany_osm_west_140619.mca) ... and I see on PC wrong maneuvers ... so it is related to data

    Edit2: end of magic:
    https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/29128487/history
    ... so it was not trunk_link before ... I would guess that the other are similar ...
    Check your log files what germany_osm_west do you really have.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    You are right about the missing lane assistant. I was so focused on the wrong routing instructions that I took the bottom-left icons as lane-assistant, but now that you mention it: I can't even remember when I saw the lane assistant for the last time.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    @hvdwolf I saw the lane assistant only a week or so ago, on a Autobahn. So it actually works. I was just wondering why it does not appear on "my" route.

    @mdx Where do I find this information exactly? Please consider that I download all maps with PC version. In PC version, when I go to the download manager, the mouseover says my current file (for Germany West) is 20140820.
    The mca file on pc has a creation date of 23.07.14 21:05.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    I haven't travelled since last Wednesday and don't need to travel for the coming 2 weeks. So I used simulation mode the last couple of days.
    Does the lane assistant work in simulation mode?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    @hvdwolf Yes, it works in simulation mode.
    In West Germany, you can use the following coordinates:

    From 52.08459/8.69132 to 52.09296/8.70166
    The lane assistant appears at the very beginning.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    confirmed.

    Edit: When checking the OSM tags I now see also why the lane assistant occurs at some points and at others not (most of them).
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    After the recent maps and app (1.3.33) upgrade, the route is currently calculated as:
    1. Bear left to Lagesche Straße - 51.99443/8.62198
    2. Ahead on Lagesche Straße - 51.99571/8.6176
    3. Turn right on Ostring - 51.99792/8.6074
    4. destination

    Better than earlier, but still not OK: I can live with instruction no. 2, but not no. 1. Is there an issue with the OSM data?


  • Vote Up0Vote Down PrzemekSupakPrzemekSupak
    For me it is obvious - Lagesche Strasse go straight (ahead on), so good maper can do it (show it on the map). 
    Sth more about it is in wiki - map projection:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Map_projection

    In Poland I had the same issue and it is still unresolved (case from Primary School).

    Try add more points - nodes on the road (lane) and/or leave note on the map - I think it should be resolved independently.

    Better maps give better result.

    (btw)
    Mapfactor also may add small algorithm to solve such cases.

    (edit)
    Interpolation may help.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    @mdx
    Look at the Theodor-Heuss-Straße:
    If Navigator sends you here from south to north, it instructs you to "turn left" at the marked point - why is that?
    In OSM, it is only one way.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down tomastomas
    straight is to Erbhofstrasse
    may be bear left would be better

  • Vote Up0Vote Down chattiewomanchattiewoman
    I strongly disagree. When you follow a main street PLUS this main street runs straight or only slightly curved, a spoken instruction is in best case superfluous and in worst case wrong, dangerous. In either case: misleading.

    When you drive such streets in reality, driving into Erbhofstraße would be turning right.
    See satellite image: https://www.google.de/maps/@51.9249219,8.8468417,125m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=de
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hurdygurdymanhurdygurdyman
    A look into your OSM-link shows, that the angle between both streets isn't 90 degrees as seen on satellite-picture. If you know the actual reality correct OSM-data and it should be ok. As far as I know routers calculate the angle at that point and then create the advise.

    Edit November 9:
    I corrected connection-node of these two streets in OSM-data.
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