Tags for highway exits?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down JohnJJohnJ
    I'm a new user of MapFactor navigator.
    I noticed that a lot of highway exits in the Netherlands give incorrect destination indication.
    e.g. The exit on the A30 Scherpenzeel, Barneveld-Zuid. (location 52,1248569, 5,5644372) gives as direction Arnhem/Ede, which is the direction when you are continuing on the highway.
    Looking in OSM, I think the data there is correct, but probably incomplete for MapFactor.

    Which tags are used by MapFactor to determine the destination of a highway exit? I'd like to add the data to OSM
  • 13 Comments sorted by
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    You are right. I also mentioned this error earlier. See also http://forum.mapfactor.com/discussion/comment/9551#Comment_9551 and later posts
  • Vote Up0Vote Down JohnJJohnJ
    The post you mention talks about problems with 1.6 version. I'm running the official version from the play store, currently 1.5.22, with map version Netherlands OSM 44-201504150.

    This could mean that the issue was already there in 1.5, or caused by the map creation.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    In that case I tend to think it is the map creation. They did change the map creation about 2 months(=2 map versions) ago. Since that time the problems arose.
    @mdx knows about this, but I (and probably he too) thought it had to do with the 1.6 version.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down mdxmdx
    Hi JohnJ,
    I tested your junction in PC Navigatator and there are 3 sources involved:
    https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/45352620
    Exit #4, Scherpenzeel
    https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/6959312
    Scherpenzeel;Barneveld-Zuid
    https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/6959338
    Arnhem;Ede

    If I take the exit (going from north to south) I see the first two. If I continue on the highway I see the last one (I would expect "destination" tag only on exist, but this one is probably (?) OK). Do you take exit or continue on A30?
  • Vote Up0Vote Down JohnJJohnJ
    First of all: I really like mapfactor. The performance, adding your own POI, routing to coordinates, it's all there.

    To answer your question: Coming from the north on the A30, I took exit 4, Scherpenzeel, Barneveld-Zuid, mapfactor showed a blue square with an exit arrow and the text Arnhem, Ede.

    I noticed this feature was not working as I expected on several exits. When my wife was driving, I payed close attention on what happened on this exit, and checked the OSM data later. Some exits are working fine, but I could not figure out from the OSM data what is the difference. I can give you a few more exits with this problem, and without the problem, in a few days.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down mdxmdx
    Can somebody else confirm issue on this crossing? I downgraded to 1.5.22 and it still works for me. It could be that there are (in the data) two "overlapping/colliding" signpost paths, but it still should be deterministic. Can you try 1.6.x available here: http://download.mapfactor.com/mapfactor_navigator.apk

    Edit:
    I can see it wrong now if you place start more than 2.5km before the exit ... so it is related to the beginning of
    https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/6959338
    which is interpreted as "destination" on the road ... is it really correctly mapped? In particular I am interested if the whole way is/has to be taken into account
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    I did not check this specific situation yet, but the first questions should be:
    - When were these tags set?
    - and did they function at that time? 

    Were they set before or after the change in map creation 2 months ago? If they were set before that time,  and it functioned correctly at that time, then the new map creation is erroneous.

    And that is definitely the case with the example I gave: The tags were set latest end of December. This is, before the changes in the map creation, and at that time it functioned correctly. I was blaming it on the latest 1.6.x builds, but obviously it is the maps.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down mdxmdx
    @hvdwolf - it is probably the same issue:
    https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/6505867
    destination = Groningen;Zwolle

    So how way tag "destination" should be interpreted? (in particular if it passes several crossings, which is case of JohnJ, not this one).
    According to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:destination this is "The key destination=*
    describes the content of signposts or ground writing indicating the
    names of the locations that the tagged way is heading to. Thus
    navigation systems can refer to road signs that the driver actually
    sees.
    " ... so that's why you see "Groningen;Zwolle" in Navigator. It is not related to the exit, but to the motorway section before that.

  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    I understand what you mean but this is very confusing.
    Why does the sign mention "Groningen Zwolle", but is it pointing to the exit. That is combined incorrect information.
    Especially when you mention the wikipedia article "The key destination describes the content of signposts or ground writing indicating the names of the locations that the tagged way is heading to."
    This is of course correct, but it means that MNF is incorrectly programmed. MNF should tell me where I need to go, not where the road is leading to where I don't want to go.
    In other words: MNF tells me correctly with the exit arrow on the signpost and the laneassistant in the bottom of the screen where to, and does not show the tags of the exit on the exit signpost. In other words: It gives completely incorrect hints of which direction to follow.

    And again as mentioned: Even with these tags in place, the maps were correct some two months ago, and "now suddenly" not anymore while the tags haven't change in between.

    In short: The signpost should tell where I need to go, be it the exit or straight on. It should not tell where the road is leading if I need to leave it and really  want to see which exit I should take.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down mdxmdx
    The map now contains more "destination" tags than before (before it was only in combination with lanes). I would agree that arrow on the signpost is wrong (should be straight instead of right). But filtering in run-time is then much more complex. The sign is related to previous junction and it should help decision on previous junction, but then it should be removed sooner.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down hvdwolfhvdwolf
    If you look at the signpost implementations in other apps, you mostly see a full screen "popup" with a blue sign post on the left and one on the right displaying both directions and some green/orange/red arrows below it to tell you where to go (I drive quite some rental cars nowadays having all kind of builtin nav apps).

    In any case: the signpost displayed should definitely display "where to go", same as the arrow and lane assistant does. Information that is totally irrelevant should not be displayed at all unless in combination with the correct info, as mentioned in my first sentence/example.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down JohnJJohnJ
    I try to follow your discussion. I understand you could reproduce it on the node I indicated. Today I took the same exit, coming form the south, taking the exit at node https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/45327993. This time, there was no destination indication at all, although all adjacent nodes have destination tags. Maybe this extra info helps pinpointing the issue.
  • Vote Up0Vote Down JohnJJohnJ
    When I go onto the highway at node https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/45342570, coming from the east, it gives me correct destination information.
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